PPCChat | BFCM 2024 – How Did It Go? | 3rd December 2024

During this week’s PPCChat session, host Julie F Bacchini sought experts’ views on BFCM period, what was their overall impression, what is there strategy for the rest of the holiday shopping season 2024 and more.

Q1: What was your overall impression of the BFCM period this year? You can answer as advertiser/PPC manager and/or as a consumer.

Well, I famously do not do ecomm PPC, so I will answer as a consumer…I was not bowled over by the offers this year. Bought a few things, but did not feel a sense of urgency that I would be missing fabulous deals if I didn’t. @NeptuneMoon

Knowing that some might view this as political – I think this year was record-breaking specifically because people wanted to avoid tariffs next year. People didn’t need to offer huge discounts because there was a looming price hike on the horizon. @navahhopkins

As a consumer, it looked sort of pitiful to me. 25% for signing up for your newsletter? that’s a June sale. For total fairness, we do a lot the week after Christmas here in Canada, so boxing day and boxing week are another push. @JuliaVyse

@navahhopkins Facts are facts… I saw a story this morning that China is limiting exports of minerals to the US that are key in chip making. So the games have already begun. @NeptuneMoon

I’m not a shopper but my wife and daughter do a lot online. They bought some, but didn’t think the offers were that enticing. @JeffreyHain

As a consumer I was blown away by how early and how persistent the Black Friday sales were. Good discounts, but not mind-blowing. @robert_brady

I didn’t find sales to be as early as last year though  @robert_brady – last year I was getting BF emails in October. @NeptuneMoon

As a consumer I spent $5k I wouldn’t have spent with the looming trade war – as a marketer, I found there were a lot of glitches and if not for how incredibly talented our tech teams are, people would have been sad. @navahhopkins

I can say that from a team standpoint, it was all over the place! My dtc pals were hard at work typing fast, my public sector pals were in briefing mode, lots of 2025 planning going on. I’ve been in presentations and parties all week. tis the season for powerpoint and power-holiday-festivities? @JuliaVyse

My two ecommerce clients both did very well on revenue. Both started their sales on Nov. 22nd and things were very good the past few days. @robert_brady

Overall mood ecom based on what I am seeing – positive – pent up demand – riding on results – 7.5/10. Personally – probably the only time I did not make a single purchase yet – waiting for extended sales & last call. @alimehdimukadam

I feel like we’re seeing a bit of a swing back toward the way BFCM was several years ago and I wish it was more-so: Black Friday being a brick & mortar, in-person event. Cyber Monday an online-only event.
I do wish that Small-Business Saturday got more love. Overall, though, I agree with @JuliaVyse — not a lot of businesses really offering the deep discount stuff that rewards consumers for paying attention. @ScottOmiller

I’m expecting a strong January with all the gift cards. @navahhopkins

@ScottOmiller Small biz Saturday should not be smack in the middle of BFCM – it is unfair to small biz who can’t offer big discounts typically.I feel the same way about Giving Tuesday being today. People are tapped out so the timing isn’t great to get dollars for nonprofits either. @NeptuneMoon

@navahhopkins  I’d love to get more of your thoughts on gift cards. My experience (though admittedly somewhat limited) has been that gift card sales sort of suck. Not many people actually take the opportunity to buy with them. @ScottOmiller

I also need to point out that travel deals during BFCM were a welcome surprise and honestly did as well if not better than product based deals. @navahhopkins

Interesting on the brick and mortar too @ScottOmiller  – I prefer online for a lot of reasons, but one is the lack of inventory in physical stores. It’s bad. @NeptuneMoon

Agree @NeptuneMoon. Maybe Giving Tuesday should be the Tuesday BEFORE Thanksgiving. @ScottOmiller

@ScottOmiller  it depends on the vertical but one thing I’ve found with clothing and beauty/skincare brands is that people don’t want to get it wrong, so they empower their loved ones to get what they want. @navahhopkins

hey, do we need a GT thread? where are we donating this year and what is meaningful to us? ignore me if you’re not in the mood, I know we’re dealing with holiday burnout already. @JuliaVyse

@JuliaVyse I can make one. @NeptuneMoon

@JuliaVyse this year more than others I’d really love an altruism thread. @navahhopkins

I am into it! plus, anything you give locally has a huge impact. does not have to be a giant across the world thing. @JuliaVyse

I will make a thread in the general channel for charitable giving sharing after the chat, @NeptuneMoon

Wasn’t running anything but I am kinda shocked I only heard joking reference to Cyber Monday. giving Tuesday blew up my inbox but with most commerce being online i wonder if the difference between bf and cm has evaporated @ferkungamaboobo

It 100% has @ferkungamaboobo at this point – it’s just discount November/December. @navahhopkins

Oh, the difference has pretty much disappeared between Black Friday and Cyber Monday. Used to be a very stark difference, now it is basically just a long sale weekend. I also agree the sales were pretty meh compared to sales of other years in the past (remember folks running each other over to get deals not all that long ago?). My age could be showing here if folks don’t remember those days, but the offers do not seem to be any more than a President’s day weekend or other. Business was still solid from an ecom marketer stand point, however, so I am also assuming consumers do not expect the big discounts anymore either like they used to on the weekend after Thanksgiving. @lchasse

I think people are more strategic in what they want to buy during the BFCM period now too. So it is not necessarily so much what is super on sale, but more is this thing I want to get for myself or a gift on sale instead. @NeptuneMoon

@JuliaVyse The other thing and I cannot find it right now, but I saw some data that buying from big box retailers only puts $0.15 back into the local economy (your neighbourhood) vs. purchases with small business in your area putting almost $0.70 back into your local economy. Pretty big difference. @lchasse

Q2: If you were in charge of advertising for BFCM, did you do anything different this year from last? If so, what did you do and why? And if not, why no change in strategy? You can answer as a consumer regarding your behavior as well – your thoughts on ads you saw.

I ran a different campaign this year for a heavy appliance retailer. Last year went great, but was their first time using Shopping Campaigns, so this year there was more dynamism between search, pmax, shopping. @JuliaVyse

Interestingly for me, most ads I saw during this period were on television (I watch football). I did not search for things nor was I on Facebook really. The TV ads were very meh. @NeptuneMoon

Answering more based on what we saw in spend/creative data (not an official study): @navahhopkins

• People seemed to lean more into function and emotion vs raw price discounts in their creative. This might be because the overall environment wasn’t forcing price cuts.
• PMax budgets stayed pretty stable despite Google leveling the playing field for Standard shopping – I was expecting standard shopping to get a boost in engagement.
• CTV continues to be the siren’s call of the ad platforms – they want us to use it but as of now, the transactional results are neutral (i.e. if you have the creative, great, but otherwise not worth investing the energy) 

Grateful for the improvement in GMC for promo pricing/bundling. Relied a lot more on rules for changing promos. HUGE time saver. Utilized Mike Rhodes’ PMax script and set for the period of the sale or just the current day ran the script hourly.@ScottOmiller

Google is pushing Demand Gen campaigns (Saw this post this morning) – I replied to the post asking for the source of the stat. @NeptuneMoon

Demand Gen is a good campaign type, too many are sleeping on it. @NeptuneMoon Youtube runs their own studies so it’s possible it came from that (especially if it’s US stats so they can just know if the person saw an ad and bought the thing). Agree it would be good to get the source. @navahhopkins

@navahhopkins I couldn’t read the footnote in the video – they have graphics overlaying it. @NeptuneMoon

Ooh! That reminds me. Finally utilized Demand Gen for BFCM. Also used a tactic I heard about at HeroConf — bidding with CPM on YT shorts (KILLED IT). @ScottOmiller

Demand Gen is the superpower we all need to use next year. @navahhopkins

Not me but a lot of DTC/Twitter folks found a new platform it seems – Applovin. @alimehdimukadam

Just remember that the goals you set for it actually do influence the algo (like paid social) @navahhopkins

Not applovin growing after actual YEARS of me crowing about the value of app/game placements in the gdn…@JuliaVyse

I do think there’s a huge difference between “reported in the ads platform” and “actually drives sales” (this is not a bad thing) in the sense that the ads platform can’t see how video ads drive sales @ferkungamaboobo

I’m really surprised I’m not seeing any discussion around all the AI creative tools. these were 100% designed to make BFCM easy and it seems like they were seen as defaults or ignored @navahhopkins

I mean, they’re pretty awful. and after the year a lot of retailers have had, they’re not going to put anything except hero creative up. @JuliaVyse

@navahhopkins Which tools are you referring to? @NeptuneMoon

This year was pretty different. We used other media a lot more compared to past years. We really have a lot of choices now with Hulu/Disney ads, Spotify, etc.. Because ROAS from Google has dropped from where it used to be for most brands, I am seeing some of my brands ask “where else can we go”?We still push Google pretty hard and we had offers (more muted than past years), but I have brands that are either keeping their budgets the same in Google for next year or in a couple cases decreasing them. Side note, those same brands are increasing Microsoft spend, because this year we actually have seen improvement from MS with their platform and the results at least in our small universe. @lchasse

Amazon’s AI image tool and the GMC Next tool. @navahhopkins

I think a lot of the tools just were quietly used. Amazon’s is pretty quietly integrated and isn’t bad if you have decent product shots. @ferkungamaboobo

That’s what I’m wondering, @ferkungamaboobo – that folks have stopped processing that they’re using AI creative tools. @navahhopkins

Yeah 15k/mo on hulu goes REAL far. I haven’t played on hulu since they added self-serve. i miss it, the reps are super nice. @ferkungamaboobo

VERY into the CTV adoption over here. raising awareness = raising more searches and interest. @JuliaVyse

I wish we could have Hulu’s reps with Amazon’s CTV product. the ROAS is amazing on Amazon but the reps are so hit or miss @navahhopkins

Oh man, the Canadian Amazon reps are pretty great! And hulu is just disney up here. @JuliaVyse

I have said not to sleep on Amazon’s campaigns for years now. Prime users now have to watch commercials during their shows unless they pay the next tier. Paramount, Netflix, etc… all have subscription tiers that require you get commercials. Smaller brands can put their videos in front of consumers now easier than ever. It used to be extremely cost-prohibitive for them to do this, but even with smaller budgets you can now have video content in front of as big of an audience as you can afford. @lchasse

Amazon’s numbers for the BF football game had to have been sky-high. @NeptuneMoon

The main reason I say CTV is a siren’s call vs an absolute winner is not everyone can deal with the outcome from it and/or don’t have the creative to be approved for good inventory. @navahhopkins

Yeah CTV is like making TV. @ferkungamaboobo

That is very true. @lchasse

it’s true, you do need good creative. @JuliaVyse

Which is why the AI tools interest me – to help brands who don’t have access to the great creative some of us do have a chance. they’re not there yet – but they represent hope @navahhopkins

The ads running on Amazon during the football game on Friday were all from MAJOR. brands. Like TMobile, car companies, etc. @NeptuneMoon

Makes sense. they want to be video first, and the game was exclusive (I think) @JuliaVyse

That being said I have seen (good content) that does not look like high-end video content do extremely well. There is something to the authenticity of regularly shot video if the messaging and the product (of course) is on target. You also need to be very mindful of the audiences you select whether you are targeting specific types of content or demographics (whichever the platforms allow and they all have different options). @lchasse

They have a LOT of hockey up here. the CRTC is not happy, but they’re definitely getting sports viewers. Agree @lchasse just keep in mind that low-prod and authentic does NOT equal done badly for no reason. @JuliaVyse

It was exclusive to Amazon except for the 2 markets of the teams playing. NFL broadcast agreements always include markets for teams get the game “over the air” in addition to wherever the game is broadcast if it is a streaming service or even when they used to run games on the NFL network. @NeptuneMoon

I’m hopeful for improved video adoption but there’s also the inventory question – Amazon’s inventory is spotless. Netflix, Disney, and Hulu are pretty clean. Google…there are real questions brands have to ask themselves whether they’re ok with their brand being shown before/after/during certain content. @navahhopkins

And heads up – there will be 2 NFL games streamed exclusively on Netflix on Christmas day. @NeptuneMoon

Brands with a lot of “branding” concerns are a little leery of Google for good reason. They have pretty poor controls of where your videos show vs. some of these other brands. @lchasse

I think you could say the same thing about the GND if we are being totally honest…@NeptuneMoon

Everyone should be using limited inventory as a default. @navahhopkins

Q3: What is your strategy for the rest of the holiday shopping season 2024? You can answer as a consumer regarding your behavior as well.

Look for areas where everyone isn’t – Microsoft, TikTok, and other discounted spots. @navahhopkins

Up here it’s a marathon, not a sprint. BFCM is done, and now the last minute shopping, through to Boxing Day/Week where all the returns and gift card use turn into end-of-year madness. I have an alcohol retailer, so we’ll be pushing right up to the 31st for Champagnes and other treats. From a consumer standpoint, I’m focused on niece/nephew gifts and baking! And asking husband for spa retreats. No need for more stuff. @JuliaVyse

As a consumer I’m being pragmatic about buying things I know will be more expensive next year. @navahhopkins

As a consumer and parent, I am in get sh*t done mode from now until Christmas. @NeptuneMoon

Computers, appliances, wardrobe, and other clear casualties. Also pigging out on produce now so I can hold myself over when fruit and veggies are 25% more expensive. @navahhopkins

@navahhopkins Been asking the kid about what spirit days they will have at school (she is on student council who decides such things and therefore must rep it) so we can get cheap items now. @NeptuneMoon

We’re shopping for a new double oven before price jump. @JeffreyHain

I will just say, don’t sleep on the other platforms like Microsoft, Spotify, Amazon, Hulu/Disney, etc… There are a lot of options out there that can do as well or sometimes even better than Google when it comes to making your ad spend go far. Google is still the big one, but these other platforms are catching up and in some cases I would argue are surpassing Google in a lot of ways. Google has been focusing on the wrong things when it comes to making platform changes. These other platforms are very hungry for those ad dollars and are in many cases making very advertiser-friendly changes to support that. @lchasse

I just got a car too. Along the lines of what @lchasse  is saying… lots of smaller platforms have reps that actually help you! And do stuff for you. And provide you with data. Shocking, I know, as we have grown accustomed to the horrid customer service and support of the Googles and Metas of the world! @NeptuneMoon

Listen! the reps at Pinterest and Snap will fully build audiences for you! there is a LOT of in platform support out there if you just ask. @JuliaVyse

Microsoft should be part of everyone’s budget if for no other reason than to find all the placements to exclude from Google. @navahhopkins

Also, be aware that PMax ads might be running on Twitter if that is a concern for your brands. Saw some folks posting about it lately. @NeptuneMoon

I am collecting ads and looking to buy if any interesting deal comes up – mostly software/ai related. @alimehdimukadam

@NeptuneMoon only if you run extended inventory. @navahhopkins

I agree @navahhopkins. We have seen improvement in ROAS with Microsoft this year and that means more $$ shift from Google to Microsoft. @lchasse

That setting is account-wide. @navahhopkins

@navahhopkins Is extended inventory on by default? @NeptuneMoon

no – standard is. you have to make the active choice to opt into it. most advertisers don’t make the active choice either way (which is bad) – almost all marketers should be on limited inventory. @navahhopkins

+ for Microsoft. Got a brand doing advertorials with Taboola – & if all goes well – looking at native as a channel for a small allocation next year. @alimehdimukadam

Q4: Have you seen any trends in advertising or sales this year that have you excited or worried? If so, what and why? You can answer as a consumer regarding your behavior as well.

This is going to sound really lame, but I love the privacy compliance stuff. @navahhopkins

I share @navahhopkins concern regarding the economy in 2025 and it is coloring my thoughts as a consumer. @NeptuneMoon

I don’t know if it’s age or the event was overshadowed by a lot of news preceding it – the excitement for BFCM was not 200% for me personally (as a consumer) this year. Can’t put a finger on it. Feels like another event sale that happens throughout the year with different labels. @alimehdimukadam

I saw several brands include really clever and accessible language around getting consent for marketing lists (obviously some discounts were included for BFCM brands) – this gives me hope. the fear is we have a looming trade war at the same time as Chrome is about to be sold off and we might lose search terms. @navahhopkins

@alimehdimukadam  I think that is at least partly because the BFCM sales are not massive like they used to be? 30% seems to be a pretty standard offer I’m seeing. Which is a nice discount, but not a “door buster” level sale. @NeptuneMoon

But that’s a general concern – not an ecommerce one. @navahhopkins

I also think Google will not be forced to sell Chrome. The incoming DOJ will not push for that. @NeptuneMoon

I don’t have a lot of companies in the electronics space, but I would be concerned here with the tariff war that we are about to have with some of our trading partners. I think most of our partners will negotiate things so we don’t have long-lasting issues, but other partners like China is pretty big so we may have some issues there. This could make our holiday season perform very well, but it may be at the expense of revenue in 2025. @lchasse

@NeptuneMoon  – I’m split on whether they will or won’t. @navahhopkins

I feel like this trend comes up for me each year but, conglomeration. I worry about small shops and medium platforms being amalgamated. I worry about retail media networks like Walmart creating both fragmentation on one side, and acquisition on the other side. I’m in a big holdco, and in a tough economy, independent shops get bought. @JuliaVyse

100% agree with you @lchasse – this quarter will be amazing but 2025 is going to be a sh*t show. @navahhopkins

@NeptuneMoon  Yes, most likely. I believe a lot probably also has to do with those news reports of people waiting in lines and creating a chaos. That added a flavor of sorts. Thinking out loud. @alimehdimukadam

I was skeptical on if Google would be punished before and still am to be honest. Washington does a lot of chest thumping without doing much. @lchasse

Chrome = 66.6% market share…it’s scary if Google keeps it and it’s scarier if it gets pushed to the government. @navahhopkins

A trade war helps no one. Forgive the soap box here, but my degree is in International Politics (with a healthy dose of economics)…We (the US) have very little domestic industry. We need resources and components from trading partners (especially China). Even American brands are built outside the US a lot.I don’t think most people have any idea how a trade war would cripple the US economy. Oh, and we import A TON of food too. @NeptuneMoon

And any third party who would pick it up would just inherit the scariness of Google. @navahhopkins

Chrome sell off not happening. Breakup of AdX, DFP, Adsense Decoupling of defaults. Those for sure. @alimehdimukadam

And in California, we have a lot of food picked by many who are classified as illegal. @JeffreyHain

Ahem, we sell our trusted friends and neighbours a LOT of water. @JuliaVyse

AI needs water. @navahhopkins

Honestly, if the current administration wanted to do something about it before they left office, they could 100% do it. @lchasse

The US imports a ton of lumber from Canada who is being talked about for tariffs, so construction costs could to skyrocket too. @NeptuneMoon

Basically, if you have any work you want to get done…do it now. @navahhopkins

Well, Congress does have the authority over tariffs – you can’t legally just do it via executive order. @NeptuneMoon

Governments move at the speed of a sloth (maybe slower) and sometimes that is a good thing, because it keeps them from doing too much harm. I am concerned about the trade war though. We depend on China for so much, it could get very ugly pretty quickly. I still remember during Covid how much the containers cost to ship for retailers. This impacted everyone and we could see similar things start to happen again. @lchasse

But on a hopeful note: I’m seeing a rise of ethical marketers. I was really burnt out going into Hero Conf, but seeing how amazing everyone was together and all the ethical and supportive conversations made me realize there is hope for us as an industry. @navahhopkins

2025 is going to be a pivotal year in a lot of ways. Political, Technological, Geopolitics, Resources, Economic headwinds – too many variables and all flammable that can lit adjacent departments. @alimehdimukadam

I was ready to call it quits sooner than later, but it really rejuvenated me. @navahhopkins

PPCChat Participants

• Julie F Bacchini @NeptuneMoon
• Navah Hopkins @navahhopkins
• Julia Vyse @JuliaVyse
• Ali Mehdi Mukadam @alimehdimukadam
• Lawrence Chasse @lchasse
• Scott Ostermiller @ScottOmiller
• Jeffrey Hain @JeffreyHain
• Robert Brady @robert_brady

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